#37 Service Dynamics With Svc. Provider Jenny

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Image of a man holding cleaning supplies for Pod Pod Cvlt Cast podcast Episode 37: Service Dynamics with Service Provider Jenny


This week we welcome Dominant Lady, Service Provider, and dear friend, Jenny to the podcast to discuss service dynamics. What is service? How can we use service in our sex, play, and relationships? Does enjoying service make us submissive, or is it separate than that?

We examine the common threads in our pasts and personalities that make us prone to being service-oriented, as well as the ways in which we serve outside of our kink lives. Content warning: Jack Russel Terriers.

Jenny gives us tips for trying service out in a painless way that just might get our dishes done.

Try new things with your partners. Have fun. We live in interesting times. Joy still exists. And so does our new community! Check out the Pod Pod Cvlt Cast Community here! Free for all, with subscription options for extra Pod access!

Click here to jump to the FULL TRANSCRIPT of this episode.

Terms of Note

We recommend checking out our glossary episodes #24 & #25 if you’d like a good list of Polyamory & Kink terms with conversational context.

Resources & References

Episode 37 Transcript

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Pod Pod Cvlt Cast 00:08
Hey everybody, how’s it going? Hello, hello.

Jenny 00:11
Hi. Oh, hi. Hey. Great.

Chastain 00:14
So we have we have a we have an extra we have an extra voice with us tonight. friend of ours Jenny is on with us.

Jenny 00:24
Hey, Oh, hi. Hi, how you doing? I am doing how are you? We’re

Max 00:30
we’re also doing yours talked about my friend doodle. And that’s all that’s

Chastain 00:36
Oh, did you already have a noodle conversation?

Max 00:38
No, not yet. No. Oh, how’s my buddy?

Jenny 00:43
Sleeping underneath my feet right now on her helipad. Well, that’s her very own PT pad because reasons.

Chastain 00:52
Oh, you should tell max about noodles walks.

Jenny 00:55
Oh, well. We’ve been going on walks twice a day for about a mile. She thinks that we’re on a

Max 01:01
long way for a little dog.

Jenny 01:03
It is not. So here’s a funny story about jack Russell Terrier. I want to read this newspaper article and it was talking about the type of dog you should pick based on your activity levels. I would say like, if you just want to go to the mailbox, a mag, you should get like a bulldog. But if you want to like run around the block a couple times maybe a golden retriever and if you want to like run a marathon, maybe a visa and at the very top it said if you want to hike the Blue Ridge trail should get a jack Russell but this is after we had her. I was like well, oh, well we’re in it now.

Max 01:37
Cuz they’re, they’re, you know, rabid dogs, so they’re very active and very fast.

Jenny 01:41
Oh, yeah. She never stops.

Max 01:43
But for them tiny little legs. A mile is like 10 miles.

Jenny 01:47
In human distances and her it’s like 10 feet. We could do it 15 times a day and she’d never run out. Like it’s irrelevant.

Chastain 01:57
Max is gonna steal your dog

Max 02:00
No, we got the one that’s that’s

Jenny 02:02
you can borrow her from time to time? No, I just visit Oh, I love her would love that.

Chastain 02:08
They would love that. So yeah, Jenny is a friend of ours from the kink community. And she is pollyannish. And she’s a bisexual friend. She identifies as a service provider and also a dominant lady. And I like how she described yourself as a dominant lady with her longtime partner, and she’s been involved with a community for about 20 years. Well, I should say, let me correct myself with BDSM for about 20 years, but on and off with the community for what about eight years, you’d say?

Jenny 02:44
Yeah, like I think my first forays into the community were meaningful. I was meeting folks in real life 20 years ago, but it was through like Yahoo and IRC and right things like that back in the day

Max 02:59
or is it Relay Chat internet Relay Chat.

Chastain 03:02
Yeah, it’s very similar to our new podcast acumen community documenting community

Jenny 03:11
as a whole different thing.

Chastain 03:15
Which is it pod podcast.com slash community and hang out with us in their discord

Jenny 03:19
was that so? You’re there right now you’re there? Yeah. Well, I’m not like, in there interacting with you right now. I thought that’d be weird.

I like weird.

Jenny 03:28
And also talk to you.

Chastain 03:30
That’s not that weird, Hannah intro.

Erik 03:32
Oh, no, that’s me. No,

Chastain 03:33
Eric’s entering intro.

Erik 03:42
Welcome to the Pod Pod Cvlt Cast, where we talk about life, love, learning and libido, and share our journey through polyamory. I am Erik.

Max 03:52
I’m Max.

Hannah 03:53
I’m Hannah.

Chastain 03:54
I’m Chastain.

Jenny 03:55
I’m Jenny. Yay.

Chastain 04:01
Don’t feel Hey, you

Erik 04:02
know, you didn’t pause long enough to wait for someone else to talk

Max 04:06
or to see if I was gonna use one of my pseudonyms. Hey, in the bio Did you say polyamish?

Jenny 04:13
Yes. Oh, okay, cool. Are you surprised by that definition?

Max 04:18
Or Well, I mean, I haven’t heard the definition yet. But uh, no, I’m not surprised by it at all. It kind of makes sense from what I know of you. But also, I was sort of surprised by the word. That’s all. Yeah. Do you want to give a definition to what that means to you?

Jenny 04:31
I don’t know. Like it’s work on I guess we’re in theory, polyamorous, we’re just not actively right now. Right. Okay.

Max 04:39
So I mean, like monogamish kind of has a specific meaning. I didn’t know if that had a specific meaning to you. That’s I

Jenny 04:47
don’t think it has a specific definition. Just

Erik 04:51
it’s just on what poll you put up that flag? Yes.

Jenny 04:55
And that’s where we’re at today. So

Chastain 04:57
all right. Excellent podcasting. No kidding. So, Jenny and I have something in common. We are both dominant ladies. And we also both really love service. And she and I taught a class. When was that? Like two years ago? It was a while ago. 18,000 moons and go because now time doesn’t mean anything. Yeah, we talk we taught a class about service and we did t service, right? Yes. We’re both really passionate about service and the fact that service doesn’t necessarily mean submissive. And on our last episode, this came up when we were talking about what we talked about last episode, I don’t even remember the difference between acts that are explicitly Yes, topping or Donna dominant or bottoming or submitted, right, right and how those rules are so easy

Erik 06:00
we flipped, right?

Chastain 06:01
Yes. So yeah, and what we what we sort of make assumptions about societally and so forth. Now, remember, thank you. So, so Jenny, how do you define service for yourself?

Jenny 06:14
In this context, service is just a, an intentional activity that has meaning behind it, I suppose. And that’s like the most generic definition I could possibly give.

Chastain 06:29
What would that entail? So what kind of what kind of things would that be?

Jenny 06:32
Well, it can be anything really, it’s what two people discuss and decide on if that thing has meaning to them. And they decide to call that service then out now that’s service. So it can it can be anything from body worship, or getting someone a drink at a party to handling all the household bills, like just it’s anything, anything.

Chastain 06:54
Okay. So right now you’re on our podcast and we negotiate share that beforehand, right? So this could be service.

Jenny 07:04
It could I think, if we hadn’t had that discussion and and that was the intent behind it.

Max 07:10

Jenny 07:12
But I am not doing this for you. I’m doing it for me. Right?

Max 07:17
Well, what the hell are you getting out of it?

Erik 07:21
Does that mean that we’re servicing?

Jenny 07:23
Oh, oh, no. I mean, possibly you can be providing a service to the greater polyamorous community. I mean, you are.

Max 07:33
Yeah, we’re already into like lingo and, and terms and stuff. And we have a disclaimer.

Hannah 07:40
Yes, disclaim. This is a podcast where we express our opinions about love and relationships, sex and kink polyamory and LGBTQ issues and whatever else comes up. While we talk about these things, we may also touch on stuff like violence, abuse and mental health challenges. These can be difficult topics. So keep that in mind. Moving on. Head.

Chastain 08:01
So when we’re talking about service, and we’re talking about what we’re getting out of it, it sounds like we have to have a goal in mind. So when you think about service for you, what kind of goals do you like to have in mind when you’re thinking about service in your life? So for example, if if this podcast is something that is a service, what what are we providing as a service? I guess our goal would be to educate that’s the service we provide right?


Chastain 08:35
way in.

Entertain and entertain, to provide comedic relief.

Chastain 08:43
Uh, yeah. So So what about you, Jenny? What do you think that with your with service in your life that you either enjoy receiving or that you enjoy giving? What are some goals or types of service that have goals attached

Jenny 09:00
My brain is like fireworks right now with so many different examples. Okay, well yeah, just like, it could be like, your goal could be the pleasure of the person that you’re with. The goal could be to make your, your little community a better place to live in, whether it’s your key community or just your regular vanilla community. It could, it’s anything from something really specific to something really broad. I think a lot of what people talk about in the kink community in terms of service is to provide pleasure to the person you’re doing it for, is why you would do it. And that’s like a really broad term, but it could be you know, you’re making them have a better day, because you’re giving them a massage and helping them relax. Or maybe you’re talking about the skills you learn to do that. That can be a service. And the goal is still to make a pleasurable experience for your partner.

Max 09:57
And we Last time, we were talking about You know, the implicit topping and bottoming dominance and submission stuff like we were talking about service topping, and sometimes that service isn’t to ride pleasure. It’s to beat the hell out of somebody if they want, right. Like, it can also be to provide pain if that’s something they’re looking for and an experience that can also be service.

Jenny 10:24
Yes, what I’m saying pleasure, maybe it’s a bad word for it.

Chastain 10:28
No, I don’t think it’s about where I think maybe it’s giving somebody what they want. Maybe, yeah.

filling a need.

Jenny 10:35
Mm hmm. Probably fulfilling a need is the best way.

Max 10:39
Yeah, so this is jumping around a little bit and probably would get into it later anyway. But do you find that for you personally, it’s not just about capital or relationships, or

Jenny 10:54
kink stuff or whatever. Like, do you find yourself being like a service kind of person in your work life? Then in your your relationships with like, family of origin and that kind of stuff, too. Oh, absolutely, like it ebbs and flows. I’m just like every other sort of identity that you have in life. I’m definitely at work. I’m the helpful person, you know, and the one who has become the go to for certain things because I learned how to do a whole lot of thing so that I could be useful. And for me providing service fulfills a need within me to be useful, whether that’s at work or in my personal relationship.

Max 11:31
Yeah, I have a lot of the same stuff like in my construction, my particular little piece of construction where I had a apprenticeship there are a lot of things about apprenticeships that are weirdly like DS relationships. But one of them is service like you always kind of provide service to the to your master and to the older guys on the job. And then as he learned stuff too. So I kind of found that parallel for myself too. When we really got into kink community and kink identity stuff, I found that like, I was cleaning other guys tools, because that’s just the kind of person I am also related to, you know, doing scenes for people because I enjoy that kind of service. Also,

Jenny 12:25
do you enjoy cleaning tools for other folks? Or no, I just, I just find it

Max 12:29
as a matter of,

Jenny 12:31
you know, I mean, it’s a legitimate question I don’t

Max 12:34
particularly enjoy. But I find it as a matter of respect for guys that like, have taught me to do what I do. And you know,

Chastain 12:43
it’s sort of like, Hey, man, let me get that for you.

Max 12:45
Oh, well, so it was a I mean, I can talk about this for a long time, but no, it was it was definitely a part of my apprenticeship that was just expected that at the end of the day, you couldn’t get pools and you also clean your masters tools. This just

Chastain 13:04
doesn’t also help you like learn how to cleaning tools really well, why

Max 13:09
impresses upon you the need for taking care of your things. Right, right. And you learn how important that is for both the longevity and the ease of use of your tools and stuff. And there’s a thing that I note in young guys that I see on the job who didn’t actually serve real apprenticeships, who just like worked for their dad or whatever, right? Where they don’t understand the sort of like, nuances of those kinds of responsibilities and what’s just like, polite, you know?

Erik 13:46
Yep, I can, I can second that. All of that. Having also done an apprenticeship. That was, like, half of it. It wasn’t just the trade you’re learning It was how to do the trade you we learned, you know,

Max 14:04
right, and the respect for people who had been there and done it and brought you the things so that you could teach the next people the things right. Yeah, because that’s what your next step was, was to bring along the newer crop.

Hannah 14:17
Right. So it sounds like that type of service also relates to someone who’s in a position of authority over you. Definitely, which is not the only way but the way we often see service Express, right, you’re paying a special type of attention to the needs of somebody who is in authority.

Chastain 14:36
So I just want to do kind of a quick, Round Robin, because we’ve already heard from now, Eric, and Jenny, and Max, about feeling sort of a in your professional lives and personal lives that aren’t necessarily in a kink or sexual space, about having sort of a service oriented mind or person Hannah, this is something that you and I have talked about on the podcast before, but just for the listeners Now, can you talk briefly about how your relationship with service in your life in a vanilla sense?


Hannah 15:17
I would definitely agree with that impulse to like make my time at work, whatever that drop has been. You’re really focused and helpful and focused on others. And, you know, the customer service aspect of any job is always where my attention is naturally drawn. But that really has been like a lifelong thing. Honestly, since I was growing up to like, literally follow in somebody’s footsteps is really satisfying, and just to give sort of undivided attention and try to, like, focus my skills on to somebody else’s goals, which is the thing that could get you in trouble in life, I’m sure But it’s also been a real asset, you know, in life and relationships and in the workplace to say like I am here, and I’m getting satisfaction out of serving a group or serving the goal of this situation, as opposed to maybe serving myself or trying to gain my own advantage out of a situation.

Chastain 16:21
I identify with that really strongly, you know, and in my quote, unquote, corporate upbringing and was, you know, don’t ever say no to an opportunity, because you don’t know when that opportunity will come by again. And so I was always saying yes, and if I couldn’t handle the workload, I would find a way to delegate it. But I enjoyed being a support person. And in my personal life, I enjoy being a support person. I enjoy serving my family and my house and I enjoy serving my, you know, like community and workload and like all of it, and creative ways and I find it challenging. I find that Like, it allows me to use all my talent and skills in very interesting ways. And so like, it’s definitely just a part of my personality. And so I think that, like, it sounds like all of us have that as just part of who we are. And I don’t know if it comes from upbringing or the, you know, communities in which we were raised or I don’t know. But it sounds like all of us have that in us. And then we bring that into the relationships that we are entering into and the dynamics that we’re entering into as people. Jenny, would you say that that’s true for you?

Jenny 17:38
I went that it’s based on my upbringing or that

Chastain 17:40
or that, that just like throughout your life, that it’s really something that that has been a theme in your life, that it’s always been something that you’ve enjoyed. Oh, absolutely. So I listened to your podcast last week, and I believe one of the things Hannah said was that when she first came in the community

Jenny 17:59
she have things done to her. So she thought that she was submissive when someone told her what to wear, like nine o’clock or so, you know. Similarly, when I first got into the community I wanted to be, and like even for like, even 20 years ago, I thought I had to be a submissive because I wanted to be the one doing stuff for people. And it wasn’t until I heard the term service submissive that I finally identified with something wholeheartedly, because and then later I listened to some other folks speak on it and, and they used the term service provider, because I’m not necessarily submissive. And that’s why I’ve held on to that label for myself. So, to answer your question, yes. is where I was going with that.

Chastain 18:49
I really liked that orientation service provider. I’ve always considered myself service oriented. You know, I’m a service oriented top. I’m a service oriented DOM. So So I think service provider is a great way to shape that. So thank you for bringing that into my lexicon.

Jenny 19:07
Oh, yes. I think that I think there’s like a, there’s people that thinks that labels don’t matter. And there’s people that think that you do. And I think that labels are really important to yourself personally, but that it’s important to make sure that you have the same definition of me, as everyone around me. So they understand what you’re saying, when you hold on to that label.

Chastain 19:29
Yeah, we agree. We agree. And I think, you know, I think you and I were at the same meeting when we heard somebody talk about the importance of like, speaking from the same dictionary. Yeah. Yeah.

Max 19:40
Well, yeah, I think it’s particularly in the kink world. Like I think it’s a world where we tend to respect labels more than than otherwise, right? Like it’s just part of the whole thing. Whether it is Dom or submissive or service or whatever, you know, we tend to say Like we really need these words who really need these labels. So everybody knows how to relate to each other and and what’s going on.

Jenny 20:10
So, interestingly enough, I think that in our maybe it’s just our local community because I don’t have a lot of experience with other local communities. But there is a definite difference between labels in online communities that are spaces that I’ve been exploring recently in real life entities. So that’s why I say now it’s important that everybody is has the same definition because I think that all of us have the same definition for a lot of words, but it may be because we grew up in this community. Can you can you expound on that or give it a give an example. For me, I thought that it was common knowledge that a top was a Dewar and a bottom was a receiver, right? And a dominant was A person in charge in a relationship and a submissive as a person in charge or person. Not in charge and relationship, right? Who gives up? Yes. But that is not common lexicon online. They they kind of use dominant for everything. Whether you’re in charge in a relationship or dominant in the bedroom are dominant in this scene, like it’s just, it’s I’ve seen it used a lot that way.

Max 21:28
Right? And, I mean, it’s kind of wild speculation, but do you think is just because it’s people who don’t actually interact in the real world, and they can just sort of use words willy nilly, without, without any religion?

Jenny 21:42
No, mate, Perhaps it’s because the people that I interact with now are not from the same real life space as we are, and they’re from different places in the world. So it could be it could be a language thing, because perhaps not everyone speaks English as fluently as we do. But it also could just Maybe that’s what it was like for them growing up in their kink community and setting how those were these, but I do think there’s there’s definitely some folks that are just new and don’t know, too. So,

Erik 22:11
yeah, I think it’s safe to say that on the internet, a lot of people just misuse terms.

Mm hmm.

Chastain 22:19
Eric has art resident label, deny, like that label, deny or label further lately? I don’t know what to say. Or label something or other. But yeah, Eric, wait, you you, you know, you don’t subscribe to labels for yourself, really. You’re just you know, you’re just you. And you’re also newer to the world of kink in terms of exposure. So,

Max 22:53
but not in terms of exposing himself but not in terms of exposing

Erik 22:58
usually, no No, I don’t, I don’t subscribe as much to the importance of labels because that makes them inherently more rigid and or at the very least less fluid, less subject to change. And through that inherent rigidity, people can put too much stock into that and not see that a different label can actually be the exact same thing, which is kind of what you were saying already. Yeah, it’s it. The context is more important to me than the label itself. That’s, I think, the most succinct way that I know how to say that.

Hannah 23:40
I agree with that. I wish I could remember where I read but it’s been years ago now and I haven’t come across it again. I was reading an article that was talking about how in the business world for a long time we really had to labels it was leaders and followers and you want to be a leader because that’s how you succeed in business. And this article was saying, actually, there’s a third group of people that we don’t have a name for, who are people who just rise to the moment, right? If there’s a gap in leadership, they step forward. And then when a better leader comes along, they easily

Jenny 24:15
roll their switch.

crucial part of a stable

and it’s brought me so much joy. I think that like at least once a week, I want

Hannah 24:28
to be that person. I mean,

Max 24:30
you know, in baseball, we call that a utility infield. Yeah. There there are terms for that, but they’re not agreed on. I

Erik 24:38
mean, interest industry, apparently, we call it me. Because there’s shortfalls on both sides to have to fill those gaps.

I mean, you fill that gap? Well,

Max 24:51
you know, just just well, while we’re talking about terminology, and then we can just go back to talking about services and stuff. But while we’re talking about terminology, I think That like the only place where there is a rigidly defined rule of what all terms mean is religion, right? Because we’ve had, you know, several thousand years of universities and scholars and and people in leadership saying these are what these things mean. And we all have to agree on them. And that’s what they mean. And that’s the end of it. And anything else in the world? Whether it’s

Chastain 25:26
business you mean Western religion?

Max 25:28
No. All Eastern religion has the same thing.

Erik 25:31
Yeah. But like religion as a concept,

Max 25:34
anything else in the world, whether it’s business or kink or whatever, like, Oh, you have is like kinky business? Yes. Like all you have is people writing books and saying, This is what I think it means or small groups of people getting together and saying, This is what we think it means. Like you don’t have an international like body that rules on this This is what this word means and what it will mean for the next 2000 years.

Jenny 26:04
You know, so,

Max 26:06
yeah, I mean, I all terms are sort of fungible, not just in the kink world, but in all worlds really. And I’m going to let the dog out.

Chastain 26:16
Who has a dog out, Max? Max, Max, Max, Max, Max. Thank you. A brief, brief, brief, brief, brief.

Erik 26:34
Brief nine times.

Chastain 26:35
That wasn’t nine times off topic, so people who are in any way involved in legal sex work, so camming, sex coaching, anything that could be considered lewd or not able to apply for any kind of small business loans. So if they’re, you know, independent contractors and things like that, like so, states are allowing them to apply for unemployment right now, but they’re not allowed to. They can’t qualify for any of the small business loans that are being given out by the government right now. Because of some conditions in there that say that they are not giving money to anybody who does anything dirty. That sucks, right? Yeah. makes me sad. So that was it. That’s all I had say about that.

Just as an aside to nothing.

Chastain 27:32
So what kinds of service Do you specifically enjoy? Like, what’s your favorite sort of service? If you had your druthers right now, what would you be doing

Jenny 27:43
to receive service I really like body service and that’s like a general term for those that don’t know about just like body care for someone home. So I really like having like taking a bath and having someone brush my hair and put lotion on me and that sort of thing. I find it really connecting.

Chastain 28:08
It’s very intimate. Yeah. And there’s a lot of trust involved with that.

Jenny 28:12
Yes, very much. And it’s personal. And it’s no because my mind, I am not an exhibitionist. So my body is for me and my partner. And that’s it. So if I allow them access to that, that’s really special. And special in terms of providing service, like I think my, maybe the broadest term would be like a maid. But that means like a housekeeper, but maybe also a lady’s maid. That’s been my thing lately, is

Max 28:50
a lady’s maid.

Jenny 28:51
So it would be like for example, if y’all were hosting a party, and I came over and did check ins hair and her makeup and helped her get dressed and put her shoes on and you know make sure throughout the night that she’s presentable and that sort of thing so like that like really gets my motor going

Max 29:12
does that also with a lady in waiting was

Jenny 29:16
no it those are I think I’m waiting and waiting to send it to you as functions that perhaps well maybe they didn’t get it right so

Chastain 29:23
sometimes ladies maids were chosen from lesser royalty and it was considered a like an honor to be chosen and to be able to attend court to get to dress royalty and hear their secrets and be their

Hannah 29:39
company Exactly.

Chastain 29:40
And White their bottoms and things like

that. I’m not feminine weapon anybody. Right? Right. Oh, man.

Chastain 29:47
Right. Yeah, it’s it’s sort of like having a sort of like having a personal secretary in the Edwardian sense of the word not the 60s skirt chasing sense of the word. Hi, it’s Justin from a pod podcast if you love listening to the podcast if you’re having a good time right now, we encourage you to check out our Patreon, visit our website, pod podcast.com. Slash support the pod find out everything you need to know about our membership levels about our community that’s brand new, where you can come and chat with us and live events with us. While we’re recording all kinds of cool things in addition to an exclusive Podcast, where we talk about polyamory and kink in music, movies, books, you name it, even if it’s not actually about polyamory kink, we’ll try to find a way to make it so we have a good time. We want our patrons to have a good time. Special thanks to our patrons for supporting this show our patrons make our website our hosting everything possible. So if you like what you hear, enjoy what we do, please consider supporting us so that we can keep those podcasts fabulous, fun. Going for you. Again, that’s podcast.com slash support the pod, I’ll let you get back to the show.

Jenny 31:15
When I provide service for folks, it’s always because I’m a little bit in love with them, if that makes sense. And it’s not even like, and I don’t mean like they’re my partner, and I know 100% about them and I’m in love with them as a person, it could be that I’m in love with the idea of them or what they represent in that moment. Because I have to have some sort of connection with someone in order to feel satisfaction from doing it. Otherwise, it’s just work to me. You know, I think it’s the difference between maybe doing something at work for someone that I really respected versus doing customer service because it’s a part of my job and I’m obligated to be nice to somebody. That’s what the difference is for me is that I want to, I want, I need to care about the person at least Little bit in order to want to do it.

Hannah 32:03
So that connection could be like just for that event, maybe. But it’s something different than, like, I got paid to be here

Jenny 32:15
to clean houses for money, and I cried for free and it was much more meaningful when I was doing it for someone for free. And like an in a service II kind of way, then it became just transactional.

Hannah 32:28
And I imagine that just like in your every day, cleaning your own house. That’s not necessarily No, I know. You’re saying your doctor, somebody who loves chores or loves work so much

that you’re not in love with yourself. How can

Erik 32:53
give me up for where I was gonna turn this whole conversation?


Hannah 32:59
Eric Have you fallen in love with yourself tears, satisfaction from?

Jenny 33:06
Well actually,

Erik 33:08
you know and allowing ways that I look at this sort of thing. Be it. I’ll start out with the framework of work. Okay. Yes, it’s a job. Yes, I’m getting paid for it. Yes. But the pride that I take in the work that I do the appreciation of that work is the point of the service to me. Meaning it’s when when said service is performed, and it is greatly appreciated. That is 100% and ego trip for me. It’s Yeah, taking pride in the services rendered and the service satisfaction there in that I dig on

Hannah 34:04
that place, like where your motivation is coming from?

Chastain 34:09
And how many times would you say that you’re servicing yourself date? I

Erik 34:15
didn’t say that at all.

Jenny 34:19
Eric, I’m really excited that you said that, actually. Because something that I always say when I’m talking about service is that I don’t think that service has to necessarily be altruistic. And that it’s okay and expected to want something in return for doing it. And what I want is praise. I want someone to acknowledge that I did the thing. So I’m completely on the same page as you. Hmm.

Chastain 34:45
So that said, so we’ve talked a little bit about what services we’ve talked a little bit about some different, different forms of service, you know, ideas of what service could be. So if you were talking To the listener at home, and they were interested in getting started with service and they were identifying with things they were hearing on the podcast right now. How would you recommend they get started with doing this with a partner? or doing this with a somebody that they have a play relationship with or a power dynamic relationship with?

Jenny 35:24
Well, first thing you would talk to your partner. Yeah, we’re all adults, and we communicate with one another. But I mean, it could start off as something you wanted to like, set up a temporary scene, I’m making air quotes. where you say, Hey, I listen to this podcast and these fabulous people, and they were talking about service. And I heard what is the name of that podcast? It’s called pod cast coat with a beat sorry, yeah. But I heard that one of them talk about how cleaning their house Could be service. And, and in this scenario now I’m a guy that wants to look cute French maid. So perhaps we wanted to try this out clean house feet. So you of course like want to set something up. So it’s not just you’re cleaning the house for someone because that’s super boring but you’d want to talk about what you would be willing to do for what you’re for your partner and what they are expecting to receive out of that situation. And like what sort of interaction you would want during it or if you want any at all. And also, since it’s a theme, you need to discuss what your limits would be. And any aftercare you might want to do and you would negotiate. I don’t know if you guys have had a podcast on negotiation,

Chastain 36:47
not strictly but it’s it’s definitely coming up. It’s Yeah, we talked about all the things.

Jenny 36:55
Tell them what you want to do and what you don’t want to do. And then try it because it Worst case scenario, and this one is that you have cleaned out. And I brought, you know, what you’re gonna do anyway. So

Chastain 37:07
the worst case is you’ve done something that you were already going to do. And you felt the way that you were already going to feel about it is what I’m hearing.

Jenny 37:16
Yeah. But you’re just going to try and see if you can put some intention behind it and get a different feeling.

Chastain 37:21
Like I love that you said that because one of the things that I’m passionate about passionate about is mindfulness. Part of mindfulness for me is developing rituals around the things that I do. And our ritual is only doing one mindful thing after the next and if you are intentionally cleaning something, then you’re just paying attention to what you’re doing and focusing your intent into it, just like you said. So, you know, last week, we’re trying to encourage our listeners to try new things. And that might be a great way for our listeners to maybe incorporate a little bit of service into their play and stuff. I’ll be pretty cool. Yeah, I think sexy, fun time. Yeah, really sexy fun times.

Max 38:02
I know, we’re in a world where we’re not introducing new partners and stuff right now. But when we do eventually get to a place where we are meeting new people and doing new things, and if if we just want to bail out on this because it’s too fraught or whatever, that’s fine too. But, you know, we’ve all had like negative experiences with with surrogacy kind of relationships where they’re on the top or the bottom do anybody want to talk about a little bit about like, how to safely find someone that you want to enter into a service relationship with and what to watch out for and you know how to be careful.

Chastain 38:41
I can give, I can give an example of a situation I’ve had. So in my, my long answer, and I’ll use your word again fraught search for somebody to do service for me because I like it. I like the ladies made scenario like to have somebody to brush my hair and to make my bed and tend to my clothing and do some things about the house and whatnot. That’s the thing that I enjoy greatly. I have I guess auditioned would be the best word and just hasn’t gone well. Because typically the people who messaged me aren’t reading the very very bold large font to print that I am writing in the in the very small clear words that I am using that say not looking for any kind of sexual services or contact, just looking for somebody to do my dishes and be nice to me. So, but the because a lot of

Jenny 39:57
a lot of people

Chastain 39:58
unfortunately, seemed to misinterpret service as giving oral sex and not looking for oral sex. Like I don’t I don’t care if you want to do if you want to do the dishes naked that’s fine. Like however whatever makes you happy I just want to have the dishes done.

Hannah 40:17
And wait I could have been doing dishes naked this whole time. Yes, yes.

Jenny 40:20

Chastain 40:26
Yes, yes. Always make it all the time. However, moving forward, I’m now I’m distracted.

Jenny 40:38
You were saying you don’t want service on your hoo ha.

Chastain 40:40
But I don’t want service on my hoo ha I have people for that. Thank you. person for that. Hello, Eric. So

Hi. Hi. Okay.

Erik 40:56
Just a million different almost said references from From the movie Scent of a Woman, but they never really surface. But

Hannah 41:07
is that service though, like when people come in with a mindset of I have one thing that I want to do now, it’s not just my service to you

well accept my service having from the bottom that somebody

Erik 41:18
that wants to be

Jenny 41:19
disagree it can be though, because you should have a you can have a very specific scenario that you’re wanting to play out and that’s okay. Absolutely, absolutely. Now you’re saying like, I would like to be, you know, service a woman by honey, my pain inside of her. And that’s kind of weird, but you know, right.

Chastain 41:37
Well, if somebody says like, if somebody says I would, I would like to orally serve as a lady, and that’s all I want to do. And I thought, that’s great. However, that is not the type of service that I personally prefer to receive from people with whom I do not have an otherwise intimate relationship.

Erik 41:56
Well, just like in any other market, there has to be more for that service there’s usually not just for the record there is there

Chastain 42:07
is there is a market for that service I have a list of six people that I can think of right now who are looking for that service. And I could just message them and go like hey, you know like there’s a dude in this town who’s like ready for you? Unfortunately pandemic right?

Erik 42:23
I just mean in the sense that you can’t go advertising a marketable skill that’s not how I leave it out. Cut this part out. Huh, it’s just not your your your first go to

Jenny 42:50
the oral service.

Erik 42:54
It just seems like a scam to

Max 42:59
any other thoughts on what to watch out for what how to be safe.

Chastain 43:03
So to be safe, to be safe, like just like any internet interaction, which is usually how you’re gonna do this. You know, and especially now, it’s probably going to be an internet based interaction. But if we do get out into the real world, I mean, use your life’s and your tenders and your Oh, Casey’s and, and your adult friend finders responsibly, and vet people by, you know, talking to them first negotiating first, asking for testing results first, maybe meeting them at a in a public space first, once we’re allowed to do that out in the world. I’m not going to keep putting that caveat on what I’m saying. But you know, there are plenty of BDSM community events that you could meet somebody at, and if that person is somebody of who was Someone who is willing to be safe with you, then they will meet your requirements to be safe with them. If that makes sense,

Max 44:10
right, like questions like, asking about testing centers and asking about their other relationships and how things go, are often a good barometer just in how they respond to those sorts of lessons over whether or not they feel like a safe person or feel like a person who has good intentions. Yes.

Chastain 44:30
If somebody says something like, I don’t have any pictures on this phone, chances are they’re not for you. If somebody says something like, well, I don’t I don’t discuss that until I meet somebody in person. Chances are, they’re not for you. Like if somebody pushes back on simple questions or demands your name. When you’re not ready to give it to them, chances are they’re not for you. Like people often ask for my my name you Hey aren’t Chaston I’m on a podcast, right? Like, you can Google that right? Like, and you could find out that I’m on this podcast right? Like that’s a weird name. So I’m not gonna just give you my name because I have a weird name spelled in a weird way. And

Jenny 45:16
it is my own hates it.

Chastain 45:18
I know right? You should you should check out our show transcripts. Justin cast on guest on who knows

no one podcast like yesterday.


Chastain 45:34
So yes. Well, Eric, I have been trying to correct all of the Eric’s with a seat, but I don’t catch all of them. So I mean, you know, my pain used to it.

Erik 45:44
My fourth grade teacher never noticed the whole year. Well,

Chastain 45:51
I’m amazed that she could pronounce your name correctly.

Hannah 45:55
Well, so if we’re following you know, basic safety Asking sensible questions and demanding that we get sensible answers. Are y’all have y’all also, like sought out people who have specific skill sets? And how do you vet or maybe like even ask for references for people who have experience with different types of service Jenny?

Jenny 46:19
So what my Well, I’m thinking more of like an activity like a top versus like a service person. But I like to bottom to specific edge play activities. And by edge play, I mean, like, things that could get you in trouble medically, you know, like, things like that. But, um, I have to find someone who’s skilled in doing that in order to be safe for me, because otherwise I’m that I mean, stupid. So I’m literally not safe, literally not safe, physically, physically unsafe. So if I was trying to find Someone that do that activity, I would see if they had photographs on their profile of what they have done because I am educated enough of myself. They look to see a little bit like I’m not going to answer every question, but I can answer some questions about what their photographs are and see if they’ve tagged someone as a bottom that I can ask. So ask for references. I would also probably watch them play at a party a couple of times before I did anything with them for the first time. And I would also do like kind of a test the waters kind of thing first, instead of just going crazy headfirst. And in terms of service in particular, this might be going back more towards Mets question. Something I always tell folks to do is first as a service provider, you’re allowed to have many limits as you want. And you don’t have to do everything that the person is asking you if you don’t want to do it, but also to negotiate within a box someone is allowed to Plan, rather than say the things you won’t do. So if you’re only looking for a ladies made scenario or to provide cigar service to someone or to be a bootblack, or any of those other things that are kind of kinky, that you find someone who’s willing to stay within that box, right, and just do that. That’s streamlined. Yeah. And the same thing for if you’re going to be a service receiver, you have to find someone who’s willing to do the same you’re looking for. And if they’re ignoring that, and only talking about things that make them happy, then why what’s in this for you? What are you doing?

Chastain 48:36
Write nicely? Precisely? Yeah. Great words. Good advice. Mm hmm. A word.



Chastain 48:49
service is something that we can give and receive, and it doesn’t necessarily have any attachment to being dominant, or submissive, Or a top or a bottom? How to service dynamics work? Like how do we like how do those relationships work? Can you just have a strictly strictly service dynamic?

Jenny 49:16
Oh, absolutely. Just like you could have just a play partner who only you only see at parties and hit you with a slider. And that’s all you do. You can, you can set the parameters of the relationship however you want it to be and what’s best for you that you could have someone that you just clean their house and then leave and that’s it, if that’s what you want to do.

Chastain 49:41
But it sounds like you’re saying that there’s no right way to do things. The right way to

Jenny 49:47
do it, how you want to do it and don’t listen to what the internet tells me. But wait, like, yeah,

Erik 49:51
it’s the context. That’s important, not the label.

Chastain 49:57
Having external confirmation of the shit that we Talk about on our podcast is a little bit uncomfortable for us. So give us a second.

Jenny 50:09
Just make sure you all have the same dictionary.

Chastain 50:11
Yeah. The one with pictures right?

Jenny 50:14
That’s right. That’s Pictionary. Cuz I’m gonna slow. And I’m a visual learner. It’s actually just a horrible joke, because I’m not I’m not a visual learner at all. But yeah, I mean, you could have a relationship. That’s only service basis. That’s what you want. I’m having said all of that, but I’m always kind of weird about limiting relationships. Yeah, potential. Like I don’t like I’m not super comfortable saying, I’m only going to clean your house and I promise to never have feelings for you ever in my whole life. Like, I don’t think that’s very realistic. Yeah, you’d have to be able to have those conversations with people. You have to be able to communicate with your partner.

Max 50:55
Like a lot of how we do relationships, whether they’re lowercase Our capital our relationships, like our book, cuz all of us are that person, you know, who can never say like, yeah, we’ll just be friends who go get a drink. Every once in a while, we’re never gonna make out. Never, like our friends who will make a party once in a while, we’re not gonna fall in love, like, you know, I think that the way that we all do relationships is because we’re not people who say, we’re always going to be this and never going to be that right.

Chastain 51:30
I think I think the important thing is, you know, to just have the ability to say, I recognize that this is always out there and anything that could happen and let’s agree to have a conversation when that comes up and agree to be honest about it when it does, and just talk about it and see where we are and check in. Yeah, just my like personal experience with

Max 51:58
really service Acts and really service oriented relationships like I’ve only ever had experience with seeking a person for a one or occasional thing for a specific, very surfacey thing. Like I know when I say Oh, yeah, I’ve saw like a bootblack to fix up my boots every once in a while, you know, and never really the same person just sort of a general call like, hey, my boots kind of fucked up like I’m looking for somebody who can take care of that thing. You know. We you mentioned like cigar service. And we had a kind of a class here on cigar service A while ago, and that is my biggest exposure to that. Like I smoke a pipe. It would be kind of neat if like, having a person like clean my pipes and like teaching someone how to pack my pipes and that kind of stuff, but also dealing with pain. So it’s not like something that I would see on a long term basis. It would just be kind of neat.

Chastain 53:03
Attention internet Max is seeking somebody to pack his pipes.

Max 53:06
I’ve actually thought about like teaching the laborers at work, how to pack my pipes. I don’t have to leave the wall again to do that.

I’m pretty sure there’s a movie out there called the labor pack my pipe. Anyway,

Hannah 53:21
here’s a you might enjoy that if the opportunity arose, but it’s not really something that like you want to be. Right. That’s it in a relationship right to accomplish,

Max 53:30
right. I mean, you know, I’ve, every time these kinds of relationships come up, I talked about how it seems kind of exhausting to me, you know, to have that full time kind of relationship.

Jenny 53:44
It is though, because receiving services is a skill that takes effort, right, as well. So that’s something a lot of folks forget about. That you have to be.

Erik 53:55
Yeah, I have trouble with that. Actually. I get frustrated with it. And would rather just do it myself. Mm hmm.

Max 54:03
Yeah, and we do we know people we have all of us including including Yujin like we all have like close friends who have those relationships. And once we’ve kind of been around for a while knows what know what goes into it like, they’re people. It’s gonna be kind of fucked up to say, but like, there are people that I know that we know all that I don’t like, personally respect as a person. But like, I do see this thing they are able to do and I’m like, Oh, that’s something I could not do. I could not be that kind of full time top. I can respect their ability to do that thing.

Hannah 54:45
Now I’m like, huge amount of dedication. And, guys

Chastain 54:52
I’m gonna need to set my team Oh,

She and

Max 55:01
she’s doing it an awful lot like the Kermit sipping the tea.

Jenny 55:05
Yeah, I just set my drink like that straight.

Max 55:12

Chastain 55:13
oh my. Ah, so Jenny, is there anything else that we need to know about service before we go out into the world and serve others? Or be served? I don’t get served.

Jenny 55:25
You get sir.

Erik 55:27
Oh, it was on this episode. Oh my god cast without that joke coming up. We almost we almost made it

Jenny 55:36
Nope. I say talk to your partner. Yeah, it doesn’t have to be selfless africare is a thing. Have fun. It’s supposed to be fun, right? I mean, it’s not supposed to be. Yeah, I mean, it might be hard work, but it’s also supposed to be fun. So don’t do it.

Max 55:57
And after here it goes both ways. Yeah, that’s it. thing that that we all of us forget a lot like. Sometimes the top needs aftercare to like aftercare it goes both ways. You might something as simple as you know, having someone clean your house, maybe they did it wrong the entire time and you’re about to choke them to death. Like you might need some aftercare to calm down like it. That’s a legitimate thing. Like it’s funny. If it is, it might drive you crazy to have someone else do it wrong all day. So yes, very good point. Thank you. Seriously,

Erik 56:30
yeah, thank you for saying that. I will reframe how I come home from work now.

Max 56:36
And you’ll clean my house better. Right?

Chastain 56:42
Sure. So Eric, when you come home from work, you’re gonna be nicer to use yourself about you’ve, you’ve

been lounging around your apartment all day?

Erik 56:51
No, I mean, when I come home from work, and everybody’s been doing it wrong the whole day. I can apply after care to myself.

Max 57:02
Because everybody else was saying, oh, and I didn’t want to be left.

Chastain 57:09
Well, Jenny, thank you so much for being on the podcast with us tonight. It was nice to get to talk to you for inviting me. Absolutely. Thank you for coming on. Is there anything that you want to plug or share with the world?

Nope. All right.

Jenny 57:26
But not that question.

Erik 57:28
Word. It’s a podcast you have to plug things.

Jenny 57:32
Oh, can I say hi to my friends on my home Discord server. Hi, Yes, Miss server.

Chastain 57:39
Yay. Oh, I’m gonna talk to the nazma server tomorrow.

Jenny 57:42
You are talking to me? Yes, Miss server tomorrow. I’m very excited. They are ridiculously excited.

Chastain 57:48
Oh, I was bouncing and I just got the please don’t bounce and signal.

Max 57:52
The couch squeak is gonna be on the recording.

Erik 57:56
You’re creating more evidence

Hannah 57:57
of the bounce.

Chastain 57:59
Mine my own I like surfing myself.

Max 58:05
That joke is

Jenny 58:11
I’ll make Cultural references that I understand. Oh,

Chastain 58:17
you’re welcome that we are also old.

Jenny 58:19
I appreciate you’re old enough.

Chastain 58:21
We do it just for you. Alright, so I don’t know how like these recordings save. So I’m going to hit the stop recording button and nobody do anything. And nobody do anything. Don’t hang up just yet. Okay. Just in case because I’m scared. But yeah, I can thank you so much and I will talk to everybody next week. Ah.

Hannah 58:52
You’ve been listening to the Pod Pod Cvlt Cast with your hosts, Max, Chastain, Hannah and Erik. Our theme music is by Lobo Loco. Our break music is by pale Blue with Goberino you can find Episode shownotes social media and contact information at pod pod cast calm. Our podcast is brought to you by our supporters on patreon.com/podpodcvltcast. Thanks for listening!

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Pod Pod Cvlt Cast

PodPodCvltCastCover podcast about polyamory/kink life, love, learning and libido